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 Post subject: hillary
PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 12:06 pm 
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okay bush was an embarrassment and his term is slowly coming to an end, but as the debates began for the next election we really need to learn from our mistakes and elect a president who cares about its country not about how much money they can spend.

Hillary Clinton scares the hell out of me she laughs too much. Our lives and our country's life is nothing to be laughed about, yes a smile or small laugh is ok, ever NOW and THEN but not on every question that's asked of you. "American can not afford me," yes, she said this... I do not trust this woman.

I've never voted before, and for the first time I feel I need to vote and encourage others to do so, Hillary really scares the hell out of me. My parents are part of the middle class, I see their finacial struggles in Bush's reign, I don't want to see my mom having to get a second job in her 50's to attempt to help our citizens afford Hillary.

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 Post subject: Re: hillary
PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 12:24 pm 
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andrea wrote:
"American can not afford me," yes, she said this... I do not trust this woman.


Can you cite sources?


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 12:39 pm 
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Sounds like another blowhole akin to Al Gore in the making.

Unfortunately she's probably going to win the Democratic nomination (I feel bad for Obama, but hey). And I have a good feeling McCain or Guiliani will win the Republican side. Hillary unfortunately over either of them.

Only person I'd probably vote for is McCain. Obama has some great ideas and ideals -- but I'd give him another 8 years at least before I'd consider him a serious candidate.

At the end of the day, all I can say is "Money talks".

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 12:51 pm 
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hillary is not going to be a good choice for president.

she's bought and paid for over and over again.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 12:59 pm 
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10/23 - Transcript for the article below and a source for the OP quote:
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2007 ... -debate-4/

Quote:
Second, she made a statement last week — and I’ve been very critical of her, but I want to tell her I agree with this one. Quote, Hillary Clinton, I have a million ideas; America cannot afford them all.

(LAUGHTER)
I’m not making it up. I am not making it up.

WALLACE: Senator McCain, you’re running the closest to Clinton, but you still trail her by three points in our latest poll. The biggest issue between the two of you clearly is the war in Iraq. You strongly support the troop surge. She wants to start pulling the troops out. Is that a winner for Republicans in 2008?

MCCAIN: I don’t know. And I can’t be concerned. Because I know too many brave young Americans that are serving and sacrificing in Iraq, as we speak. I would much rather lose a campaign than lose a war. And now I’m…let me just say that I know and respect Senator Clinton.

The debate that I have between me and her will be based on national security, on fiscal conservatism, and on social conservatism. It will be a respectful debate. That is what the
American people want. Now, one of them will be spending. I have fought against out-of-control and disgraceful spending that’s been going on and I have saved the American people as much as $2 billion at one stroke.

In case you missed it, a few days ago, Senator Clinton tried to spend $1 million on the Woodstock Concert Museum. Now, my friends, I wasn’t there. I’m sure it was a cultural and pharmaceutical event.

But the fact is…my friends, no one can be president of the United States that supports projects such as these. And I believe that wasteful spending has got to be eliminated. And I will have this debate and win because she is a liberal Democrat and I am a proud, reliable, consistent conservative Republican. That’s why I’ll win.



Some other interesting reads...


Republican strategy against Hillary:
http://www.boston.com/news/nation/artic ... e_clinton/

Clinton's Inevitability:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21456015/

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 1:21 pm 
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a c i d.f l y wrote:
Only person I'd probably vote for is McCain. Obama has some great ideas and ideals -- but I'd give him another 8 years at least before I'd consider him a serious candidate.

At the end of the day, all I can say is "Money talks".


:goldstar: +1

i've always thoought that McCain has a lot to offer.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 3:53 pm 
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Ron Paul...

That is all I have to say about that.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 4:02 pm 
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i like mccain too, but in one of his interviews he said something that put up some yellow flags. He has too many connections w/n the military. One of his interviews he said something along the lines; I help negotiate a deal b/w boeing and someone else and got them a better deal, NO ONE else could have done this. The strong statement of this interview was when he said, "i know what's wrong with our military and I can fix it," if the word help was thrown in there it would have been a stronger statement... but it is live. Honestly I don't think is strong enough though to beat Hillary.

I like Gulianni (sp?) he understands the underworld and has worked with it managed for sometime in NY, and with the growing illegal immigration problem I think he has the right mind and understandings to handle it for a win win situation. Plus he IS strong enough to beat Hillary.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 4:04 pm 
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if giuliani gets elected we're pretty much fucked.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 4:10 pm 
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why? i really haven't been keepin up with this stuff until I heard someone say, Hillary might win.

I think as long as Guilianni gets a strong cabinet he'll be okay

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 4:13 pm 
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he's just going to dig this hole we're in way deeper. he's not the person to fix anything or even put it on the right track.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2007 6:25 pm 
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December 1st, 2007 by admin
Should Hillary Clinton be the President?
A quick refresher course, lest we forget, on what has happened to many “friends” of the Clinton’s.
1. James McDougal - Clinton ’s convicted Whitewater partner died of an apparent heart attack while in solitary confinement. He was a keywitness in Ken Starr’s investigation.
2. Mary Mahoney - A former White House intern was murdered July 1997at a Starbucks Coffee Shop in Georgetown. The murder happened just after she was to go public with her story of sexual harassment in the White House.
3. Vince Foster - Former White House counselor and colleague of Hillary Clinton at Little Rock’s Rose Law firm. Died of a gunshot wound to the head, ruled a suicide.
4. Ron Brown - Secretary of Commerce and former DNC Chairman. Reported to have died by impact in a plane crash. A pathologist close to the investigation reported that there was a hole in the top of Brown’s skull resembling a gunshot wound. At the time of his death Brown was being investigated, and spoke publicly of his willingness to cut a deal with prosecutors. The rest of the people on the plane also died. A few days later the air Traffic controller committed suicide.
5. C. Victor Raiser II- Raiser, a major player in the Clinton fundraising organization died in a private plane crash in July 1992
6. Paul Tulley - Democratic National Committee Political Director found dead in a hotel room in Little Rock, September 1992. Described by Clinton as a “dear friend and trusted advisor”.
7. Ed Willey - Clinton fund raiser, found dead November 1993 deep in the woods in VA of a gunshot wound to the head. Ruled a suicide. Ed Willey died on the same day his wife Kathleen Willey claimed Bill Clinton groped her in the oval office in the White House. Ed Willey was involved in several Clinton fund raising events.
8. Jerry Parks -Head of Clinton’s gubernatorial security team in Little Rock. Gunned down in his car at a deserted intersection outside Little Rock . Park’s son said his father was building a dossier on Clinton. He allegedly threatened to reveal this information. After he died the files were mysteriously removed from his house.
9. James Bunch - Died from a gunshot “suicide.” It was reported that he had a “Black Book” of people which contained names of influential people who visited prostitutes in Texas and Arkansas .
10. James Wilson - Was found dead in May 1993 from an apparent hanging suicide. He was reported to have ties to Whitewater.
11. Kathy Ferguson- Ex-wife of Arkansas Trooper Danny Ferguson, was found dead in May 1994, in her living room with a gunshot to her head. It was ruled a suicide even though there were several packed suitcases, as if she were going somewhere. Danny Ferguson was a co-defendant along with Bill Clinton in the Paula Jones lawsuit. KathyFerguson was a possible corroborating witness for Paula Jones.
12. Bill Shelton - Arkansas State Trooper and fiance of Kathy Ferguson. Critical of the suicide ruling of his fiance. He was found dead in June, 1994, of a gunshot wound (also ruled a suicide) at the gravesite of his fiancee.
13. Gandy Baugh - Attorney for Clinton ’s friend Dan Lassater, died by “jumping” out a window of a tall building January, 1994. His client was a convicted drug distributor.
14. Florence Martin - Accountant & subcontractor for the CIA, was related to the Barry Seal Mean Airport drug smuggling case. He died of three gunshot wounds.
15. Suzanne Coleman - Reportedly had an affair with Clinton when he was Arkansas Attorney General. Died of a gunshot wound to the back of the head, ruled a suicide. Was pregnant at the time of her death.
16. Paula Grober - Clinton ’s speech interpreter for the deaf from 1978 until her death December 9, 1992 . She died in a one car accident.
17. Danny Casolaro - Investigative reporter. Investigating Mean Airport and Arkansas Development Finance Authority. He slit his wrists, apparently, in the middle of his investigation.
18. Paul Wilcher - Attorney investigating corruption at Mena Airportwith Casolaro and the 1980 “October Surprise” was found dead on a toilet June 22, 1993 in his Washington, DC apartment. Had delivered a report to Janet Reno 3 weeks before his death.
19. Jon Parnell Walker - Whitewater investigator for Resolution Trust Corp. Jumped to his death from his Arlington, Virginia apartment balcony August 15, 1993. He was investigating the Morgan Guaranty scandal.
20. Barbara Wise - Commerce Department staffer. Worked closely with Ron Brown and John Huang. Cause of death unknown. Died November 29, 1996 .Her bruised, nude body was found locked in her office at theDepartment of Commerce.
21. Charles Meissner -Assistant Secretary of Commerce who gave John Huang special security clearance, died shortly thereafter in a small plane crash.
22. Dr. Stanley Heard - Chairman of the National Chiropractic Health Care Advisory Committee died with his attorney Steve Dickson in a small plane crash. Dr. Heard, in addition to serving on Clinton’s advisory council personally treated Clinton ’s mother, stepfather and brother.
23. Barry Seal -Drug running pilot out of Mena Arkansas , death was no accident
24. Johnny Lawhorn Jr. - Mechanic, found a check made out to BillClinton in the trunk of a car left at his repair shop. He was found dead after his car had hit a utility pole.
25. Stanley Huggins - Investigated Madison Guaranty. His death was a purported suicide and his report was never released.
26. Hershell Friday - Attorney and Clinton fund raiser died March 1,1994 when his plane exploded.
27. Kevin Ives & Don Henry - Known as “The boys on the track” case. Reports say the boys may have stumbled upon the Mena Arkansas airport drug operation. A controversial case, the initial report of death said, due to falling asleep on railroad tracks. Later reports claim the2 boys had been slain before being placed o n the tracks. Many linked to the case died before their testimony could come before a Grand Jury.
THE FOLLOWING PERSONS HAD INFORMATION ON THE IVES/HENRY CASE:
28. Keith Coney - Died when his motorcycle slammed into the back of a truck, 7/88.
29. Keith McMaskle - Died stabbed 113 times, Nov, 1988
30. Gregory Collins - Died from a gunshot wound January 1989.
31. Jeff Rhodes - He was shot, mutilated and found burned in a trash dump in April 1989
33. James Milan - Found decapitated. However, the Coroner ruled his death was due to “natural causes”.
34. Jordan Kettleson - Was found shot to death in the front seat of his pickup truck in June 1990.
35. Richard Winters - A suspect in the Ives / Henry deaths. He was killed in a set-up robbery July 1989.
THE FOLLOWING CLINTON BODYGUARDS ARE DEAD:
36. Major William S. Barkley Jr.
37. Captain Scott J . Reynolds
38. Sgt. Brian Hanley
39. Sgt. Tim Sabel
40. Major General William Robertson
41. Col. William Densberger
42. Col. Robert Kelly
43. Spec. Gary Rhodes
44. Steve Willis
45. Robert Williams
46. Conway LeBleu
47. Todd McKeehan
Quite an impressive list! Pass this on. Let the public become aware of what happens to friends of the Clinton’s.
Hillary for President? Let’s just elect Tony Soprano instead.

http://www.thoughtbombing.org/?p=10

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 3:29 am 
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oh man i needed that list this weekend... i got into a big debate and damnit i couldn't remember ANY names of the fallen Clinton friends.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 10:52 am 
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At one time I would have voted for Hillary, but not anymore. I just see more of the same with her.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 4:24 pm 
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http://urbanlegends.about.com/library/b ... _count.htm

http://www.snopes.com/politics/clintons/bodycount.asp

Don't believe anything that doesn't cite sources.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 4:48 pm 
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she's so hot.. she gets my vote. :badteeth:

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 Post subject: Re: hillary
PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 10:50 pm 
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Leslie 2.0 v2 wrote:
andrea wrote:
"American can not afford me," yes, she said this... I do not trust this woman.


Can you cite sources?


She didn't quite say that exactly. It appears to have been taken out of context and twisted by her opponents. The entire quote pulled from the Boston Globe:

Quote:
"Well, I have a lot of good, new, bold ideas, and I have to make some choices among them." She explained that baby bonds didn't have the level of political support of other proposals she had to help people pay for college. "I have a million ideas. I can't do all of them. I happen to think in running a disciplined campaign - especially when it comes to fiscal responsibility, which is what I'm trying to do - everything I propose I have to pay for. You know, you go to my website, you'll see what I would use to pay for what I've proposed. So I've got a lot of ideas, I just obviously can't propose them all. I can't afford them all. The country can't afford them all."



I would've voted for the pre-bought Hillary.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 10:58 pm 
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I don't know how anyone can say they 'like' any politician ... as if they're going to be your friend. They're not your friend. They don't give a shit about you.

Explain how McCain, Giulianni, Hillary or Obama is going to help the working man WITHOUT helping big business first... If there's a politician out there that is really looking out for the people first, I would like to be educated on who that is.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 11:02 pm 
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Izu wrote:
If there's a politician out there that is really looking out for the people first, I would like to be educated on who that is.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 12:37 am 
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shane wrote:
he's just going to dig this hole we're in way deeper. he's not the person to fix anything or even put it on the right track.


QFT

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 6:07 pm 
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Dom wrote:
http://urbanlegends.about.com/library/bl_clinton_body_count.htm

http://www.snopes.com/politics/clintons/bodycount.asp

Don't believe anything that doesn't cite sources.



plus he's the president, ppl cover for him... don't believe the media

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:56 am 
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andrea wrote:
Dom wrote:
http://urbanlegends.about.com/library/bl_clinton_body_count.htm

http://www.snopes.com/politics/clintons/bodycount.asp

Don't believe anything that doesn't cite sources.



plus he's the president, ppl cover for him... don't believe the media


A lack of proof or source doesn't neccessarily mean something is untrue. There are many intellectual thoughts and ideas people have said about government or life, but just because they don't have the credentials to back what they say does not mean their statements lack some level of truth. Unfortunately, a Clinton body count is not one of those intellectual occurences.

Likewise, there are many cited sources that leave information out, like American History textbooks for example. Academia would consider the sources to be legit, but I believe a lack of information presents a very skewed perspective. Believing something just because it cites sources is as ignorant as believing something without question.

Skepticism is a balance. Too much skepticism can cause one to reject every idea with arrogance, and not enough skepticism can breed ignorance. Just as much as people forget to listen to others, people forget to question themselves, and the ideals that are handed to them on a daily basis.

Just keep an openmind that remembers to question... which is easier said than done, but it's certainly something to strive for.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 12:54 pm 
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Izu apparently likes to argue semantics and greys.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 2:47 pm 
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Who doesn't? :badteeth:

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 11:35 pm 
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Izu wrote:
andrea wrote:
Dom wrote:
http://urbanlegends.about.com/library/bl_clinton_body_count.htm

http://www.snopes.com/politics/clintons/bodycount.asp

Don't believe anything that doesn't cite sources.



plus he's the president, ppl cover for him... don't believe the media


A lack of proof or source doesn't neccessarily mean something is untrue. There are many intellectual thoughts and ideas people have said about government or life, but just because they don't have the credentials to back what they say does not mean their statements lack some level of truth. Unfortunately, a Clinton body count is not one of those intellectual occurences.

Likewise, there are many cited sources that leave information out, like American History textbooks for example. Academia would consider the sources to be legit, but I believe a lack of information presents a very skewed perspective. Believing something just because it cites sources is as ignorant as believing something without question.

Skepticism is a balance. Too much skepticism can cause one to reject every idea with arrogance, and not enough skepticism can breed ignorance. Just as much as people forget to listen to others, people forget to question themselves, and the ideals that are handed to them on a daily basis.

Just keep an openmind that remembers to question... which is easier said than done, but it's certainly something to strive for.


Well no shit. 8)

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