i had a long and arduous conversation with a few people tonight on the basis of confederacy and the flag, affirmative action, and dressing "white" in terms of socially acceptable forms of self presentation.

it started out, more or less, with the idea of pride in the confederate flag. I strongly believe that you should have the freedom of preaching to whatever choir you want. Just as I will never condemn a puerto rican or a domincan or an irishman for waiving his flag from his window, I will never say that the confederate flag is a byproduct of hatred, rather than a result of personal pride.

at the same time, why is it that I will never find the nazi flag acceptable?

to me, the nazi flag represents hatred. To the black man i was talking to tonight, the confederate flag represents the same levels of hatred.


I dont believe, in the same context, that affirmative action is right. I was given about 20 reasons why it was important, and how it was most beneficial to the white man.
"give the black man what he wants and he will shut up." silencing the riots of the 60's by letting a few smart black men in.

telling kids that the ghetto is real, and that being hood is a life style and that you can make money as a rapper... that this is a product of the white man's media. also the white man's way of keeping black people ... "away"

good arguments, although I'm not entirely sure thats the way things are.
and if that was the way things ever were, thats not how they are now, yes? There are benchmark scores and if you are unable to perform at said levels, no matter what the culture you come from is, what is to say that you're more adept a person for the job/position in school/etc.?



and then we begin to speak of historical movements... what changes history... a person or a people? was it napoleon that changed the world or was it his army? Was it martin luther king jr, or was it a million black people fucking shit up?

We read of napoleon and mlk.

we study the movements.

which is the driving force of change?







i suppose i never achieved a conclusion outside of "I'm a product of the reagan era"


your thoughts? it is, in fact 4 am and I'm drunk and tired, so I could be completely misfiring. Perhaps other minorities would be able to explain as well, this point of view that, although I agree with some of the points, I really dont find a "white man" conspiracy theory all too valid.

The flag is just a symbol of different things to different people. The swastika had a long history as a symbol before the Nazis got a hold of it. Buddhism uses the symbol, as well as Hindus. Although, they have reversed the symbol to the left to try and distance the association. So it can represent many things to many people. But that symbol in particular, got a serious bad rap after the 1940s.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swastika

I think the same thing can be said about the confederate flag.To some, it ties them to their ancestors who might have been great warriors back in the day. However, if you are of African or minority decent, it is seen as a flag of repression. It represents kind of a last stand of seeing certain groups of people as a slave class. So, you can see why these simple symbols can stir up a great deal of emotions.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confederate_flag


I think when you get deeper into the roots behind the Flag, you find more history that can clarify the meaning. It is a ashame that some symbols like the swastika, will always be seen differently by the Western cultures. A symbol of everything we hate as Americans. At the same time, it could be the best symbol someone lays eyes on in a totally different situation and culture.

As far as social movements go, they tend to bond people through a common interest, or proximity. Urbanization and industrialization are credited with jump starting movements early on. Whether it was a union or a social gripe, these factors along with advances in communication made it possible to have social change.

the swastika used to be a good luck symbol and a star or sun symbol. even used here on little cards and shit for good luck momentos prior to the 1940s.





http://www.heathenworld.com/swastika/

hmm

what a way to waste your first post.

you shoulda just said +1

well since the last post was over six months ago, i didn't really think that it was THAT important. i just want to acknowleaged what i have read.. hmmmmm, interesting. but thank you for noticing

o ok.

+1 i mean.

LOL no blacks are going to read this because black people can't read

Fred Fred Fred Fred..... I see that you level of understand of the purpose this tread was lost upon you. start from the top and read down again... look up the big words they may help frill in those gaps in your mind. seeking understanding not to fuel the hate. so, one has to question.... is it better not to be able to read or to read and NOT understand?

Fred Fred Fred Fred..... I see that you level of understand of the purpose this tread was lost upon you. start from the top and read down again... look up the big words they may help frill in those gaps in your mind. seeking understanding not to fuel the hate. so, one has to question.... is it better not to be able to read or to read and NOT understand?

-2

engrish?

Just_My must be black.

Nah, just too mature for this board...

We are children here.... And it's fun.

This thread was way too fuckin' long for me to read.

Well, I can tell you that being able to read what you've written and not being able to understand it has nothing to do with MY intelligence level.

That's all your fault.

The confederate flag doesn't stand for racism.

It just so happens that everyone who waives one is racist.

i am puerto rican. there are times i'm somewhat proud to be puerto rican. but for the most part the general population of hispanics that i see walking the mall/at work/anywhere else...are the reason i'm generally not proud to be of latin heritage. you will never see a puerto rican flag tatooed across my back/hanging in my window.

However, you will find my name tattoo'd in old english across her tit.